Irrefutable Proof for Evolution?

I see a video like this as proof that evolution, is indeed true and affected by the survival of the some genes. In this case, the natural selection factor of the equation is substituted with the manual selection of the parents by humans.

In a way, this shows that overtime, animals do evolve and we can roughly select certain traits to be passed on. The motivations for breeding this cow are certainly monetary, but I'm sure that there's a lot to learn from in regards to to genetics, and evolution.

What I like about this example, which is essentially an experiment, is that it shortens the evolution process from thousands of years to within a human lifetime. Selective breeding is pretty much manual evolution. Doesn't mean I agree with it, but it clearly shows that the concept of evolution is not just an idea or a theory but actually fact.

8 Comments

  1. that’s a big ass cow

  2. Yup, lots of muscle.

  3. Hi Oscar,

    I am part of that Cars and Coffee group. Thought I would check out your blogs and maybe have a friendly discussion with you. I found this one particularly interesting being a Christian myself and believe that God created everything. Now I hope you don’t think that because we may have different views we can’t be friends. For at least we have a love for cars in common!

    So that being said, I find it interesting that you would have a blog on evolution. It seems that if evolution is true, then, who cares? If evolution is true there is no accountability and really, it shouldn’t be a discussion.

    Or, is there something else involved? It there a point to trying to prove that there is some validity to it? Is there and axe to grind, so to speak?

    Now, here is a question, If evolution is absolutly true, why would you want to tell your children that you are the decendants of a monkey, rather than, in my view, made in the image of a loving God?

    Ken

  4. Hi Ken, I think you might have asked me for a photo of your car from the first time I went to C&C. Welcome to my site. I am all for open discussions, hence the public blog. However, I would not call it a blog on evolution. Evolution is an interest of mine, as is the study of religions. I read a lot about religion, and faith; as much as I can get my hands on. I’m curious, I’m curious to know why we as humans believe in stories that can’t be proven.

    When you ask “is there a point to trying to prove that there is some validity to it?” I don’t think I’m trying to prove anything. Over time we have pretty solid evidence to show that evolution is more likely than creation. I’m simply bringing this particular video to the attention of anyone that happens to care about these issues. I think it is important for society at large to question the things that get spoon fed to them, passed down generation to generation.

    To answer your last question, are you kidding me? If evolution is absolutely true (lets go with that argument for now), why would you tell your children anything other than that which is true? And after reading and learning more and more about “God” over the years I’ve come to learn that he is far from a loving God.

    Two things come to mind, one check out The End of Faith, and this video that my buddy sent over a while ago. It is by Pen and Teller, and whether Christian or Agnostic, or Atheist, or Catholic or whatever your faith or/and belief system is, anyone should watch this video. Link the first 50-70 seconds define it.

  5. Oscar, yes, you took one of my favorite photos of my car!!

    Proving there is a God is a matter of perspective. I believe I can, but if a person isn’t willing to believe then is doesnt matter. Like for instance, I can prove evolution isn’t true, but if you don’t want to see it, it doesn’t matter. Like you said, to you God isn’t loving, but to me there isn’t anyone more loving. Interesting…

    Science has proven evolution isn’t true, but many people don’t want to believe it. So they deny the evidence. That is why science is now coming up with intellegent design.

    Now, something you wrote, Bible stories haven’t been proven? Well, I don’t think that is accurate. There have been over 25,000 archeological discovers credited to the Bible.

    What I find out to be true, people don’t want to believe in God for very specific reasons. They have gotten hurt by people that call themselves Christians, they see what religion has done in the past, or they just love living a sinful lifestyle.

    The greatesest need that people have is forgivness. That is proven! Animals don’t need forgivness, animals have no moral code. That is what separates us. All you have to do is look at society and see that everyone is searching for something. Animals don’t do that. I have learned personally, that restoration was my greatest need, and I have it now. So I no longer search. I am on a journey.

    Most people thing that Christianity is for weak people that need a crutch, and that it is just a blind faith. If you knew me, I don’t think you would say that at all. I have good friends that believe much different than me. I do think it is a greater leap of faith to believe in evolution. That is just me. My point is, it is not about intellegence, because there have been very smart evolutionist, and there have been very smart Christians. It is a moral issue. Once you aknowledge there is a God, now you become accountible, and people don’t want to deal with that.

    I want also to make a note, I am not religious at all. When I speak of God, it is the God of the Bible not of religion. Just for the record!

    I have another question, if there is a God, would you want to know it? Answer truthfully, and then you will see what I mean.

    God has given us an overwhelming amount of evidence. Granted, not always easy to understand, but there is enough.

    Off the subeject, do you still go to cars and coffee. I will be there sat. If you go say “Hi”

    Ken

  6. Hi Ken, thanks for the reply and sorry it took me a while. I’ll just go down the comment and address what you’ve said.

    The problem with what you said “if a person isn’t willing to believe then it doesn’t matter” is that the argumetn is fundamentally flawed. This is precisely why faith and religion rub me the wrong way so much! How can you possibly be “willing to believe” a bunch of tall tales and physically impossible feats/events/stories without some concrete proof. The examples of these unbelievable stories are a dime a dozen. Think, virgin birth, parting the red sea, fitting not one, but TWO of each species in a boat.

    Science has proven evolution isn’t true… Care to elaborate… this makes no sense to me.

    25 000 archaeological discoveries credited to the Bible? Fair enough, I was referring to the fantastic stories told in the bible, like the burning bush, the raising of the dead, walking on water, etcetera. I wasn’t referring to things like the temple, or whether there was a mount Sinai or not.

    I don’t know about the rest of the world, or many other people outside of those that I know personally, but I don’t have a specific reason for not wanting to believe in God. I believed in God a long time ago, and I did so because of peer pressure and at some point I really did believe the bs I was dishing out. You could find me at coffee shops, street corners and other places handing out tracks and verses to bring people closer to God. I truly believed this until I actually thought about it. I personally don’t have a specific reason NOT to believe in God, I simply cannot find one good reason to believe in God and blind faith doesn’t cut it for me.

    I don’t know that the “greatest need” that people have is forgiveness. I can think of a few other needs that would trump forgiveness. I don’t know what “restoration” you are talking about? Congratulations on finding what you were looking for. I in the other hand, will probably continue to search for answers until my last moments.

    I don’t’ know about most people, but I think that monotheistic Religions in general are crutches, not just Christianity. How easy is it for someone to say “well give it up to God” or “God works in mysterious ways”. It is simply taking responsibility away from us, and also giving credit to something else. I have found that we get what we work for, and we fail where we lack. Our destiny/fate/future isn’t written in the stars. If praying for something to change instead of taking action to make a difference yourself satisfies you then by all means, knock yourself silly with prayer and faith. Let me know how that works out. I in the other hand, think that there are tangible ways in which we make a difference and at the end, success or failure depend in the effort, strategy, approach and many other factors… not in some supernatural being answering our pleas for help.

    I do give credit to religion in some cases for bringing a community together for the well being of its members, but this can be seen in agnostic organizations as well.

    Religion and Atheism are not about moral issues, we are moral before and beyond a book and a doctrine. We are naturally moral and decent, there are those that break moral code and ethics in both religious and atheist circles.

    Before I take off… To answer your question, “if there is a God, would you want to know it?” Absolutely, he should come down and show himself. I’d love to go on a water walking adventure, Now THAT would be evidence good enough for me. 🙂

    Oh and about cars and coffee, I go once in a while. I was there a couple weeks ago with the UK classics. I’ve been so busy though that I probably only make it once a month or so. This is the latest photos I have (go to Flickr) But I will definitely look for you next time I’m there. Good luck and

  7. KEN

    We are not descended from monkeys! Or apes– We might have shared a common ancestor millions of years ago, but monkey apes, etc., all are MODERN animals, meaning, to have evolved from a thing, it couldn’t be living with you in present day. The spiritual factor (for those of christian belief following the King James Bible version of creation) comes in when you consider this: God, was speaking metaphorically! He was using parables, (where do you think Jesus got this from?) Is it so hard to believe, that evolution was the tool God used to create complex, perfectly attuned life-forms for this planet by means of Mother Nature? After all, God was speaking (in the bible version) to a people who thought the earth was flat, and who were illiterate, let alone capable of understanding something as complicated as genetics! He (God) was just putting things in terms the people that lived thousands of years ago could comprehend, IN A METAPHORIC, SYMBOLIC, TERM! Use your common sense, the answers are all there waiting for all us to stop bickering and splitting intellectual hairs if we would just put down our petty differences and listen!

    Thank you for your time, to all who read this little rant. We all have the choice to make this world better, or worse.

    Ehsona

  8. Ehsona,

    Nice of you to drop in! First, Oscar and I are not bickering. We were discussing. Second, this discussion is more of “Is there a God or not”.

    Now I take it that you believe that there is a God. The problem with your theory is the lack of evidence. You say the Bible is written in parables. Do you have proof of that? I know Jesus used parables but that doesn’t mean all stories in the Bible are parables, does it? What happens when people start taking the Bible out of context is that you start making up you own idea of what God is saying, doing, or thinking. Then you have your own new religion, and then it doesn’t stop. In the beginning God created man in His own image. That is enough for me! When you start adding to that is where the problems begin. This is happening way too much. Then it becomes, all roads lead to God, and then, all good people go to heaven, and so on and so on.

    Then you start to say the Crucifixion was a parable, so was the resurrection, and that the shedding of His blood is just a story. Where does it end? When you say it does?

    Don’t distort the word of God to accomplish your own Ideas or agendas. I’d rather stand firm on what God says is His word, than to start listening to mans own ideas of who or how, or what God is.

    Ken

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